Hi,
when using the plugins Waldorf PPG Wave 3.V, Emulator X2 (in WinXP) or Proteus (VX) abnormal CPU-Spikes occur in the Taskmanager, which shows that one Core of the Prozessor (AMD Phenom II X4 @3.6GHz) uses at least 50% of power when playing some notes very fast.
This also results in audio-crackles and finally that the audio engine of Orion 8.02 stopps, even if the CPU boarder is set to 100%. The same plugins work fine in the same situation with Cubase and the same adjustments (latency) of the audio card (EMU) and needs there 10% of the CPU average core power at maximum.
Please, Richard, have a look to this issue.
CPU SpikesModerators: Christophe, Mark
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Re: CPU Spikeshave you ticked the Multi Processor box in Audio Output Options?
Windows 11 Home - 12th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-12400 2.50 GHz -32GB RAM
250GB SSD - 1TB HDD | M-Audio Oxygen 25 V
Re: CPU Spikes
Of course ! Audio crackles occur if one core reaches 70%. "Stop engine when CPU..." is set to 100%. Something must be wrong with the audio-engine and / or multi prozessor engine. Projects made with Orion V7 have audio-stutters and crackles in V 8.02 but not in V 7.62.
Re: CPU Spikesmight be the stream buffer size, its been changed from 1024 samples in 7.62, to 128 samples in V8
Last edited by Kriminal on Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Windows 11 Home - 12th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-12400 2.50 GHz -32GB RAM
250GB SSD - 1TB HDD | M-Audio Oxygen 25 V
Re: CPU Spikes
Can this be changed somehow and anywhere in order to test if this is the reason ? When not could Richard offer a prefernce option to change this size ? Beside this, I don't need and use any Sample-Streaming with any plugin cause everything is loaded into RAM !
Re: CPU SpikesStream Buffer Size is related to streaming a project, not to the realtime playback.
ASIO buffer size or DX/MME latency are the relevant factors here. Admin - Synapse Audio Software
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Re: CPU Spikes
Therefore the reason must rely on what I have written before. I have also detected that opening of generators influence the audio-engine to crackles und stuttering, especially when the CPU is at least at 30% of usage with the system described above.
Re: CPU SpikesAre you sure this happens with only those plugins? I don't have them so I can't test with that, but I cross-posted this on the beta forum to see if anyone can test this.
What are your buffer size settings? What driver? Admin - Synapse Audio Software
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Re: CPU Spikes
Hi Richard, I have yesterday evening detected the true reason for the audio pops,stuttering and crackles. Its the plugin delay compensation implemented in Orion 8.02. At first I have to say that my basic start Project ( Basic Template ) works fine under Orion 7.62. ( EMU ASIO driver with 20ms Buffer Latency and EMU 1820 M Audio Card ). With the same settings the CPU needs 30% without any note played because of the many VSTi's and VST's loaded in the EFFECT-BUS. And this is ecactly the problem in Orion 8. There are 24 Master-Effects inserted in the four buses with the help of the Multi FX Chainer in Orion and two in the master channel. When I playback my little demo song the audio beginns to crackle, poping and stuttering. I have then made a test, by switching off one effect after the other in the EFFECT-BUS and was surprised that the audio signal became clearer and clearer. When 14 effects was switched off everything sounded normal without audio crackles etc. The second test was that I let all effects on and changed the ASIO BUFFER SIZE to 50ms. The result was that the audio crackles disappeared while playback of the demo song. But when I played at the same time with the MIDI keyboard EmulatorX then audio pops appeared. Don't forget that the same project works normal with Orion 7.62. Eccept that in Orion 8.02 I have made an additional template with some more VSTi's loaded because of the 4GB switch for Win7 64bit, and tested this also. So please have a look to the plugin delay compensation feature of Orion 8. Also in Cubase 4 a identical Basic-Project works without this problems with latency and audio crackles. Thanks !!! I will post this also as an own Topic, because it has not much to do with CPU-Spikes. CPU-Spikes: Beside this the Waldorf PPG Wave 3.V needs also in Cubase at least 10% of the CPU power, but its equal to all cores, in Orion 8 it uses only one core. If now this core is already very bussy it leads to 80% for this core or even more which leads to audio pops and crackles ( or so called CPU-Spikes ). The prevous detected audio-pops from other VSTi's have the reason in what is described at first. Maybe an other Multi-Prozessor features in Cubase, I don't know. Can you have a look to this ? Sometimes also the moving of a window causes audio-crackles while playback, but it could have to do with the first or the weak graphics card, or have others also detected this phenomenon with other PC-Systems.
Re: CPU SpikesTo summarize, if you turn off APDC then the CPU spikes disappear?
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Re: CPU Spikes
I have tested this now, and its independend from the Mixer Parameters - Plugin delay compensation - in prefernces of the project settings, the audio-crackles remain. Only if I switch off effects in the EFFECT-BUS channels the audio-crackles went away. If from 24 effects in the four channels 14 are switched off playback is without crackles. The same project runs under Orion 7.62 without audio-crackles and pops. I am wondering if no other users have complex projects with Orion, they must detect the same. The delay compensation problem referes here to the VSTi's not the mixer-parameters. But it seems that there is an influence between the VSTi's and the plugins in the Effect-Bus channels. Exists there a plugin delay compensation to the VSTi's ? Some big VSTi's calculate complex filter and effects and have therefore a little delay to output the signal and if this run additional through Effect-Bus channels with many effects then its get summarized to some ms. But as mentioned before, the same project runs fine in Orion 7.62 regarding this issue.
Re: CPU Spikes
if plugin delay compensation show zero (0) you don't need to turn it on !!! the difference with orion 7 is that the bus were not PDC ! the difference in CPU should be there ? Yamaha CS-30, Roland SH-1, Roland MKS70, Focusrite Scarlett 18i6, Yamaha FS1R, Oberheim Matrix 1000, Novation Remote 37SL, Korg Legacy, Alesis M1Active 520, Novation Launchpad Pro, Push2, Intel i7-7700HQ
Re: CPU Spikes
Ok, I have switched off "Plugin delay compensation" for Mixer Parameters and stored the project. After recalling it, the playback is now better, only very few crackles, but when playing to the playback with EmulatorX or PPG Wave 3.V some fast notes more crackles are audible again. At the last test I haven't stored the project with the new change. ( Normally this change should be applied immediatelly ) Nevertheless something must have been changed to the audio-engine and delay compensation because in Orion 7.62 there is no problem. Last edited by Merlin on Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: CPU SpikesAre the effects internal (Orion effects) or external (VST or DX Plugins)?
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Re: CPU Spikes
Third party effects from KarmaFX and Kjaerhus Audio (Classic Serie ) (all are VSTs). The quality is very good but VST-SDK is 2.2 and 2.3. Especially when the delays and reverbs from KarmaFX (SDK 2.3 and SDK 2.2) are switched off the audio crackles went away. But it worked with the same plugins in the same buses in Orion 7.6. Kjaerhus Audio VST SDK for all plugins is 2.3. Maybe there are some VST SDK Specifications lost for 2.1, 2.2, 2.3 and even 2.4, because the Mousewheel support for adjusting poties and sliders which worked for most VSTis in Orion 7.6 like CronoX2, Xphraze, Hypersonic2 and other is lost and doesn't work in the new Version of Orion.
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