Orion 9 Wishlist 2014

[Kriminal]

A better question would be why doesn't Orion sel?

The million dollar question....

orions dead, let it go.

[Reny]

Hello. Haven't write here for ages but checking Forum from time to time. Hope everybody good.

About Orion discontinuing, these are terrible news, really terrible. I am heading with pretty strong move's into mainstream music and wanted to suggest Orion to all. About lack of of customers and support for Orion, I must agree about what Solid Technica said...

I knew that Orion had some weak points, like Automation, no Time-Strech and some other things, but I learned how to find a way to work around them. Never wanted to change DAW, because I'm so used to Orion, loving it! Hope Richard will change mind. Till then, have a great 2015!

[Suonoecomputer]

We can stand here and do a thousand proposals or assumptions .. In the end the choice will only Richard .. I hope that chooses the best solution for not killing Orion .. Good luck

[Christophe]

Speaking of donations. I'd be willing to donate 1000 dollars to Richard!

imho, Rich need time not money
what about paying an external dev to update Orion ?
he can invest some money and get back by releasing a paid update ?
or if he can't invest he can launch a community founding http://www.kickstarter.com

[Teksonik]

That's certainly a better idea than just allowing Orion to die. I would love to see Orion's Pattern per generator workflow added to Reaper since it already has a very well respected Audio Recording workflow. I don't know how it would work technically speaking but something like calling up an Instrument in Reaper would have the same Pattern Selector that Orion's toolbar has and then those patterns could be added directly into Reaper's Timeline. You can sort of get this now with "Midi Items" but you have to name each one and keeping track of them is a mess. Just having Orion's A-H 1-8 Pattern selector each one calling up it's own Piano Roll would be very cool. Selecting the length of each Pattern as we can now in Orion and so forth.

I don't have any idea how that could be made profitable for both Synapse and Cockos or whether from a coding standpoint it's even possible but if I had a magic wand to make it happen....... I just hate to see Orion die but the reality is that there are not enough Orionauts to make it financially viable to contiune developing it any further. No one can blame Synapse for making this decision.

I'm excited about the announcement of a new Sequencer from Synapse but it would be a very long development process especially if starting fresh from a blank slate. Unless Rich means a Sequencer that could be used in other DAWs rather than a full standalone DAW. I think that would be an interesting idea.

[dmassive]

While Orion works I will use it. Thanks to Jbridge I can use non supported VST like Waves... for now.

Something I never got it is...

1.¿Why Orion never make something to become popular? In 15 years only 1 serious "demo" song included, and that song is incomplete and plenty of samples, and even worse, that samples not included in the samples pack.
Time & Money is not excuse, anyone can make some videos showing a product in one hour or less.

2.I asked this a lot of times, ¿Why don't supports Waves VST?, the most popular plugins in the world.

3.¿15 years and only in English? Yes, I know English is 1st option ever, but for marketing is a bad decision.

[Solid Technica]

There's still a ray of hope guys. Richard posted in a thread on kvr that he is open to the idea of having another developer take Orion further and would even help finance it. It's good to hear that he still loves Orion He also mentioned there are other people interested in helping finance development further. I will also join in helping in whatever way I can and encourage others to do so as well, especially if you are using Orion everyday and plan to use it for a few years still to finish all the tracks that are incomplete, like me So help spread the word with devs you know or try to find them online. Hopefully Richard will launch a kick starter campaign pretty soon as well to help finance the developement of it, but first we need an actual developer.

[Richard]

Thanks for the info!

Just a suggestion... ¿Could you consider release Orion (or part of it) as an Open Source Project?

This is tricky due to licensing restrictions (VST, ASIO, among other things) which cannot be open sourced.

[Solid Technica]

Thanks for the info!

Just a suggestion... ¿Could you consider release Orion (or part of it) as an Open Source Project?

This is tricky due to licensing restrictions (VST, ASIO, among other things) which cannot be open sourced.

Yeah, that's right. Toxic 2 and Toxic 3 couldn't be release via open source cause either maxx claster or maybe imageline 'own' them. Not sure about wasp though. I'm sure though in spite of the greater good, these products could be dropped from any open source release. Maybe there's a slight possibility of Maxx offering them to old users of Orion to keep compatibility issues. He gave me a free copy of EJ way back when and he seemed very reasonable. Have no idea about the other things like asio etc. But I'm thinking it could be up to the user to download and install them if necessary. I'd say let the open source idea be the very last option. There is no guarantee of an Orion spin off from it, at least much less so than having a developer come on board with the express purpose of furthering Orion as it is.

[swatwork]

Rather than give the whole thing away why not create a cut-down free version to help promote Orion as a commercial product. Take away support for external plugins, limit the generators/effects to a useful subset (like Pro used to be) and make it available for free. Similar to PreSonus' Studio One Free. If there is sufficient interest this could at least act as a catalyst for further development, either at Synapse or externally (Kickstarter?). Who knows it might even improve sales of Orion 8.5 - but you'd have to put it back on the website first

[Solid Technica]

They use to have different versions of Orion way back when. It's an idea to consider but I think the name of the game at this point is increasing Orion sales, not giving it away for free. If it was part of a bigger paid release or a way to gather interest for a kick starter campaign, then I agree, it sounds like a good idea. Someone also mentioned starting a subscription service to Orion similar to Adobe and Cakewalk. This could be exactly what Orion needs as it would provide a steady monthly income to keep developing. I think it's a very valid option to consider and it can provide exactly what Orion needs at this point in time. Cakewalks model doesn't sound so bad. http://www.cakewalk.com/Products/SONAR/Membership

[swatwork]

Orion needs more users not the same users spending more and more money - unlike some I'm not prepared to spend $1000 on a DAW

Creating a free, limited version of Orion might help raise its profile - if people like it enough they will want the full version. If not then it's probably time to call it a day.

[Solid Technica]

I understand what you are trying to say and agree it could be a good idea to a point. However I do not agree this is the only solution and if it'd fail, close up shop. Not at all. Orion needs to be updated with new features to attract more customers, not a cut down version of a product that hasn't seen an official update in almost 4 years. Attracting new customers with a limited free version is a good idea if there is a bigger picture involved. Like an update in the works or maybe even as an incentive for the kick starter campaign. I would definitely not rely on that being the only method to keep Orion proceeding in the future though I've already emailed someone who develops Daw's and is working on an open source project at the moment. Hopefully I'll hear back from him soon.

[swatwork]

Attracting new customers with a limited free version is a good idea if there is a bigger picture involved.

That was pretty much my point - use a freebie to attract interest in current/future versions of Orion.

Orion needs to be updated with new features to attract more customers, not a cut down version of a product that hasn't seen an official update in almost 4 years.

That's just your perspective as an existing user - someone new to Orion wouldn't care as much as it would all be new to them.

Of course future development is important and new features keep things going but I don't believe there is some 'critical mass' of features that will suddenly propel Orion into the 'big leagues'. Orion has seen significant development over the years but has mostly remained underrated and overlooked when compared to similar DAWs such as FL Studio and Reason. I think finding new audiences for Orion is as important as adding new features, at least for it's longer term viability. A free version is just one suggestion as to how that might happen.

[swatwork]

imho, Rich need time not money
what about paying an external dev to update Orion ?
he can invest some money and get back by releasing a paid update ?
or if he can't invest he can launch a community founding http://www.kickstarter.com

If this is the case then I suspect any amount of marketing/funding is not going to solve the fundamental problem that Richard can only do so much. The design/specs for Orion are probably buried deep in his head and even if other developers were to come on board it would still take up a disproportionate amount of his time guiding them. Also, if Richard isn't going to work on it I'm not sure I would want anyone else to - without the insights of the original developer it's not certain that any further changes would be for the better.

I can definitely understand the desire to concentrate on more profitable work and if Richard is unable to work on Orion maybe it is time to just let it go.