Automated patch change for Dune demo?Moderators: Christophe, Mark
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Automated patch change for Dune demo?I have an iMac (Snow Leopard OSX 10.6.7), Cubase LE4, several synth plug-ins, and the demo Dune. The Cubase LE4 operation manual is rather vague on how to do automated patch changes for a synth plug-in. I have never figured out how to do this for any synth plug-in. It seems like Dune might be set up to do this relatively easily, hopefully. Is this possible with the demo Dune? If so, could someone help me how to do this?
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?Do you mean you want to change a patch while the song is playing?
I don't think that is supported by any host. Pretty sure not by Orion as it makes no sense IMHO. Why don't you use another instance of DUNE? With todays processing power, there's no reason why you should switch a patch during playing a song. If you switch a patch during runtime, how would that new sound fit into your song? You would have to fit it in beforehand and then load the patch. Why do that? Why not have a 2nd instance of DUNE and bring it into your arrangement when you need it?
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?Yes, I am interested in having a single track of Dune that has automated patch changing (while the song plays). Why? With Cubase LE4 you can only have 8 tracks of computer plug-ins running. I have toontrack Superior Drummer on one track, u-he Zebra on track 2, XILS synths on several tracks, Arturia Analog Factory on one track, and Dune on one track. I have used up all 8 of my tracks, and not allowed to have more MIDI tracks like this. I could bounce the audio of these tracks to different audio tracks, but then the sound quality wouldn't be quite as good. I would have to spend about $200 to upgrade my Cubase, and I went through many hours of misery getting Cubase LE4 to work properly, and many hours learning how to use it.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?try Reaper, its 'free' basically...you should have to pay for using it, but its a non crippled fully functional demo version
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Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?
1st of all: The limitation is bad of course. 2nd thing is. It Still makes no sense. If you want to go for music production, upgrade. Whatever program you use. A runtime change of patches gives the host hickups. One reason why it is not supportet by Orion. And, especially from a music production process makes little sense. 3rd thing is. If you host doesn't provide this "feature", DUNE will also not do the trick.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?You can send program change messages (and bank I think, I'll check later) to DUNE, but it probably depends on the host. Also, whilst it is possible to do this in Orion, for instance, Orion (and possible other hosts) do not record the program changes when it comes to playback or streaming the project to a wave file. Maybe it is different with Cubase.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?
Does it really work with Orion? I talked about that with Rich couple of years ago and he mentioned that implementing a runtime patch change would not be a good idea as for the reasons I mentioned.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?It does, but isn't recorded. I've had a similar conversation with him about recording program changes. IIRC his main concern about recording was if you were to try to change sample based programs and the glitch that would ensue. One of the reasons that I wanted to be able to record was to attempt some primitive wave sequencing with whatever VST/generator I wished. Also note it doesn't work for all VSTs - mostly those that have their own patch management system like Zebra, Alchemy etc.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?I just checked and bank changes work as well. You need to send a Bank MSB value of 0 to the appropriate MIDI channel followed by a Bank LSB of the number of the bank you want, i.e., 0, 1, or 2 for banks 1, 2, or 3 of DUNE followed by the program change message and the program number that you want.
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?I just remembered another reason I had this conversation with Rich about program changes. It was so that I could change styles on the fly, which didn't work properly before. It does now. This, AFAIC, really opens up Orion for proper live work, rather than using live sets. Imagine that you have all your generators set up with all the sequences you want as style presets. You can then flip between them with program changes on the fly. Imagine the fun (if you're in to that kind of thing). Make sure you have a style without any note data in it though as a sort of mute generator function. Also, don't try this with the sampler or any other sample based generator, unless you want the glitches
Re: Automated patch change for Dune demo?I appreciate all of the responses! I have snooped around the Reaper forum off & on for a couple of years, but it sounds like there is a lot of bugs with Reaper and Mac's, but maybe it's better now (I haven't looked lately). I started using hard disc recorders in 1996; Cubase is the only computer-based DAW I have used (for about 1 1/2 years) & it was a very big learning curve for me. I got an e-mail from Steinberg today saying I could get Cubase 6 Elements for $100. I think I'd rather pay $100 & hopefully have less bugs than Reaper, and not have to learn an all new DAW.
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